In Acts 16, we find Paul and his companions on a journey of faithful ministry. The Spirit unexpectedly blocks their plans to preach in Asia. Instead, through a vision, they’re called to Macedonia. Arriving in Philippi, they encounter not a ready-made congregation but a group of women praying by a river outside the city gates. It’s here, in this unexpected place and with these unexpected people, that the Philippian church begins.
This biblical story set the stage for a recent Pivot Podcast episode featuring Dr. Andrew Root, the Rev. Dr. Michael Binder, and the Rev. Dr. Dwight Zscheile. Their conversation, much like Paul’s journey, explored the unexpected paths and challenges of ministry in changing times. How do we, like Paul, remain open to the Spirit’s guidance while navigating unfamiliar territory? How do we discern faithful ways forward when our usual plans and structures seem insufficient?
Andy, Michael, and Dwight don’t agree on all the answers. But they do agree that there is plenty of space for both caution and hope as leaders seek to guide their congregations in an increasingly secular age.
The Language of Change
At the heart of their dialogue is a shared recognition that churches must find new ways to engage with their communities in a rapidly changing culture.
Michael and Dwight have embraced the term “faithful innovation” to describe practices that help churches discern and respond to God’s leading in their contexts. Andy, on the other hand, has expressed caution about adopting business-world terminology like “innovation” in church settings, preferring to ground the conversation in more traditional theological language.
The debate over language isn’t merely semantic. It reflects a fundamental question: How do we talk about necessary change without losing our theological moorings? Andy’s concern stems from the potential for innovation language to shift the church’s focus towards a more instrumental, results-driven approach. Michael and Dwight, while aware of this risk, see the potential for reframing innovation in a way that actually deepens theological engagement.
Faithfulness Over Growth
They agree, however, on prioritizing faithfulness to God’s mission over institutional survival or growth for its own sake. Any changes in church practice must be rooted in sound theological reflection and deep spiritual discernment, not simply adopted from secular management theories.
This shared commitment to faithfulness provides a crucial corrective to the anxiety-driven pursuit of numerical growth or institutional sustainability. Andy points out that the church is not something that can “do better” in a business sense but rather is called to be obedient to God’s Word and open to the Spirit’s transformation.
Michael and Dwight agree. Their concept of “faithful innovation” is ultimately about deepening discipleship and missional engagement, not boosting attendance or budgets. Reframing success in terms of faithfulness rather than metrics offers a refreshing alternative to growth-obsessed models of ministry.
The Power of Listening
Likewise, all three agree that listening is crucial for discerning faithful ways forward in ministry.
Dwight and Michael have developed a series of practices to foster deep listening, starting with engagement with Scripture, then sharing personal spiritual stories, and finally listening to neighbors outside a church context.
“When we ask them to do something like share a story of a time when you felt spiritually alive or engaged, people are kind of like, well, no one’s ever asked me this at church,” Dwight says. These practices often reveal God’s activity in ways that surprise and challenge our assumptions.
For Andy, listening keeps the church rooted in its identity as something “created by the Word of God” rather than an institution to be ever-optimized. He suggests that we should resist trying to “fix” the church through human efforts in favor of discerning and responding to God’s ongoing work.
All three agree that listening reflects a fundamental theological truth: God is active and present in the world, speaking not just through Scripture but through people’s lived experiences. By creating space for deep listening, churches can move beyond program-driven approaches to ministry and tap into the ways God is already at work in their members and communities.
Moreover, an emphasis on listening reflects an understanding of the church as a discerning community. Rather than relying on top-down decision-making or individual charismatic leadership, the whole body of Christ is called to participate in hearing and responding to God’s call. It’s a practical outworking of the belief that the Spirit speaks through the diverse experiences and insights of the entire congregation.
Embracing Uncertainty
Andy, Dwight, and Michael also share the value of embracing uncertainty and taking faithful risks. While their approaches differ, all three scholars acknowledge the importance of stepping into the unknown and trusting in God’s guidance.
For Michael, innovation practices can help churches become more comfortable with unknown outcomes, which aligns well with biblical faith. Many church leaders and members have difficulty taking risks without guaranteed results, and learning to embrace uncertainty can open up new possibilities for ministry. Andy emphasizes the importance of faith-filled risk-taking because it’s in the places of loss and unknowing that we often encounter God’s transformative work in profound ways.
Relationships at the Core
All of this calls for deep engagement with real people’s lives, sharing in their joys and sorrows, and being willing to adapt to their needs in practical ways. In fact, the most profound innovations in ministry might not look innovative from the outside but are simply new ways of embodying Christ’s love in the midst of human struggle.
Consider the example of someone in the community who needs help getting to cancer treatments. Figuring out how to provide transportation isn’t a program or technique, but a natural outgrowth of genuine relational engagement.
In Andy’s words, “I [might] have to innovate to get you to your cancer treatments, but I’m never thinking, my gosh, this is an innovation. I’m just thinking what does it mean to see your concrete humanity and respond to your needs, share in your experience of death and loss, and see what comes out of that?”
Michael and Dwight concur: their approach to innovation is always grounded in relationship-building and community engagement. It’s about moving beyond the church walls and into neighborhood spaces, fostering genuine connections rather than just trying to attract people to church programs.
The Promise of Renewed Vitality
There are no easy answers facing the church in the 21st century. But whether we call it “innovation” or simply “ministry,” the goal remains the same: to follow Jesus wholeheartedly and participate in God’s ongoing work in the world.
The journey ahead will undoubtedly involve challenges and uncertainties. But it also holds the promise of renewed vitality and deeper engagement with God’s mission. By wrestling honestly with these issues and remaining open to the Spirit’s guidance, we can find faithful ways forward in changing times.
